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Post by reuben on Jun 1, 2007 1:50:49 GMT 8
And my choice of these key people are Qwek Kuan Uncle Wong Tan Yik Alberto Yu Hock Amin Jimboz Jimmy Aw
By the way, I did remember someone formally from the SFAS who displayed displeasure because he was not included on the team to represent our Singapore anglers to a regional fishing competition, cos he felt that the selection was not transparent. Why is he doing this(as above) then? Is he not the same now? Guys...lets not push it too far, cos, when push comes to SHOVE, nobody wins. I don't discredit the above fishos, nothing personal, but it sets a tone to" do-what-you-say, say- what-you-do".Credibility and integrity. We all screwed-up before, but it's never too late to change.
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Post by Chee Yung on Jun 1, 2007 8:10:17 GMT 8
Woa! Do keep cool guys Reuben, thanks for taking time for the cause. IMHO, we are taking some things too seriously and some things not seriously enough. Too Seriously 1) The moral high ground. IMHO we can still flyfish at ones own risk and reputation until we form the club officially. We can still flyfish in salt/ Ed's place/with SFAS at the islands when the club is formed. Just no illegal spots. If we are so scared that the representatives are blacklisted, just send a copy to the powers that be and see if there are any objections. I assume those listed are not Power Crazy and Dying to be leaders, its just a list anyway... 2) Wacking SFAS: The disagreement is over guys. We are friends now . 3) Allocated waters: It is actually a good to have and a way to test the support we have from CC. If failed, see item 1. Not Seriously Enough 1) The goodness of this club. Its a rare chance to work together for this wonderful sport. Apologies if anyone's offended in this debate but I think BT does not mean to offend.. BT correct me if I'm wrong. 2) The next step. I suggest another picnic to wrap things up! 3) Allocated waters. We need to TRY before giving up. If failed... see above. Cheers CY
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Post by BillyTeo on Jun 1, 2007 8:27:57 GMT 8
I think there is no need for sacarsm here.
On the contrary sir. The scenerio was done with all the seriousness of a concern fly fishio. I think it is better to debate and laugh at some of the things we are going to do ourselves than to let others laugh at us. If after all the transparency and full disclosure of the pros and cons, we still decide we want to go in a certain direction, rest assured my support is there. We are all adults and had weather the worst storms. Most of us can see some of the problems coming. But only one or two will really make an effort to voice out. Maybe for fear of being singled out as the odd one and maybe ostricised. Me, I'm a wee bit dirty mouth and sometimes talk a bit too much. But there are still some genuine guys out there who will say I had brought up some valid and pressing pointers which should be addressed. I want a Licence To Fly Fish, for me and for my children. I don't want them to get chased around by rangers when they go enjoy a day of fly fishing instead of hanging out in the viod decks taking drugs. As far as we know, and correct me if I am wrong, there is no "NO FLYFISHING" banners at the legal fishing spots. Yes, you are wrong. There some little words on the PUB sign which say "no fly fishing tackles" Which is why we are facing this dilemma. Form a club, people will say we're going to teach something illegal. Don't form, we "eat finish waiting to die". Go fish salt water, why should we. Go Malaysia, why should we. It all started because we care about our fresh water reservoirs and water ways.No compromise on this.
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Post by BillyTeo on Jun 1, 2007 8:50:53 GMT 8
My computer hanged while doing the last post. Then I see CY's reply. Don't worry CY, Reuben has as much passion as I have for a Licence To Fly Fish. Let me "shoot" him at some of his pointers. It a good discussion though. And totally transparent. Let me continue with my shooting debate before my PC die on me again. Some people probably think that we are shooting ourselves in the foot because we cannot continue to fish "illegally" if we we were to form this club. We will inform and educate the public that, at this stage, only designated areas are allowed to fish, and that everywhere else would be illegal. Yes, I have to agree with them too. So why shoot ourselves in the foot. So the choice is theirs. But, one day we MIGHT be able to fish at more allocated areas if our quest comes through. Can we predict? A definate NO.
We can't predict, but we can work harder to see that we get what we set out to do done. If we cannot forgo what we use to do now, and keep debating on so many "what-ifs", yet wanting to continue to fish at illegal areas, we will be doing TY and the rest who really wants this issue to go through a great disfavour. A leader leads by example. If you cannot, then don't. Go ahead with your present activities,go chionging till the cows come home, assume that the meeting to envision our quest never took place.It is not about forgoing this and sacrificing that. The core principle is already flawed for the guy who is going to take over as the leader. We are campaigning to get the rules changed so we can all fly fish legally and not be criminalised. Of course we can fish in Malaysia, Alaska, NZ etc etc. But those are beside the point. We are Singaporean and we want to fly fish in Singapore. We want our fresh waters to be available to us for fly fishing. We already took a step forward by telling everybody, that, yes we fly fishing in illegal spots. Why stop suddenly? We just pulled the rug out from the guys who sign the petition. We are telling them now......sorry ah. Please don't chiong...it is illegal. If that is what the club want to potray, than where is the moral authority to tell those guys who sign the petition?
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Post by Qwek on Jun 1, 2007 11:39:13 GMT 8
Me, I'm a wee bit ****-*** [/b] mouth and sometimes talk a bit too much. But there are still some genuine guys out there who will say I had brought up some valid and pressing pointers which should be addressed. [/quote] Billy, is that you talking or have your account been hijacked again. Please, there are ladies in our flyfishing community and also female guests reading this forum and debate.Yes, there are genuine guys out there who will say this or that and I have always ask them to share it here. If there is a meeting or discussion, they are also given the same opportunity to bring up anything they wish to say. But if they choose to say after or outside this forum then I will not repeat it for them. I have make the mistake of letting a pot telling me that another pot is calling the kettle black. We are not parrots, let them say their piece here in the forum. If they do not have the guts to say it here then tell them to shut up. It is not about forgoing this and sacrificing that. The core principle is already flawed for the guy who is going to take over as the leader. Look like you to have to fill that post. Of course we can fish in Malaysia, Alaska, NZ[/color] etc etc.[/quote] You mean we can! But those are beside the point. We are Singaporean and we want to fly fish in Singapore. We want our fresh waters to be available to us for fly fishing. We already took a step forward by telling everybody, that, yes we fly fishing in illegal spots. Why stop suddenly? We just pulled the rug out from the guys who sign the petition. We are telling them now......sorry ah. Please don't chiong...it is illegal. If that is what the club want to potray, than where is the moral authority to tell those guys who sign the petition? No, this is about convincing the authorities to legitimize fly fishing in our reservoirs. In Singapore, our little red dot. This formation is not for promoting someone's little bathtub masquerading as a fishing pond or getting fellow flyfishos to cough up membership fee for pond fishing that you cannot get access later in Malaysia. There no free rides here. Do you not see the need to form a club as proposed in the last meeting with the MP so that we can have our proposal be heard and taken seriously or just another pressure group. Look like an egg and the chicken issue. Should we carry on throwing stones to jeopardize our chance to achieve what we came for. The Vision. Cheers Qwek
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Post by BillyTeo on Jun 1, 2007 23:10:03 GMT 8
Please, there are ladies in our flyfishing community and also female guests reading this forum and debate. Okie dokie. Took out the offending words. Sorry. Do you not see the need to form a club as proposed in the last meeting with the MP so that we can have our proposal be heard and taken seriously. Yes. I also stress we need to behave honestly.
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Post by BillyTeo on Jun 2, 2007 16:59:57 GMT 8
When one begins to worry about other's opinion of one's preferences and inclination, its time to go fishing! ;D ;D The only thing that should worry us are barren waters, because everything else usually flow away with the current..... Gonna take this advice and go fishing tomorrow. Let the current sweep the stress away. Cheerio.
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Post by xxJiMboZxx on Jun 5, 2007 1:22:15 GMT 8
It seems that there is alot of anger in this thread... I wish that someone up there will help us find a way and ease our frastration.
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Post by alberto on Jun 6, 2007 9:53:10 GMT 8
Hi Jim, Maybe we should not view it as anger but as an individual's passionate statement of his beliefs and needs. It exist within all of us. If I seem quite in this topic, its because it rather talk face to face to address the issues at hand. Its has nothing to do with being not transparent, but rather not letting go of all the knnccb out in a public thread regards Alberto
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Post by Qwek on Jun 6, 2007 14:07:37 GMT 8
It seems that there is alot of anger in this thread... I wish that someone up there will help us find a way and ease our frastration. or do you meant Castration. Hey Jimboz, I think it time for another picnic. How about end june. Any suggestion for time and place. Cheers Qwek
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Post by alberto on Jun 6, 2007 18:11:38 GMT 8
Hi Q, I think its time for another picnic as well. ;D
regards Alberto
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Post by 67er on Jun 7, 2007 12:24:50 GMT 8
Jan 31, 2007, 10:48pm, ShadowCaster wrote:The only thing that should worry us are barren waters, ..... Haha, of fools and greatminds! I think barren waters are totally unnecessary, not if I can help it
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